Lesson: Comparisons - Part III - "like" vs. "as"

Comment on Comparisons - Part III - "like" vs. "as"

Precise and clear explanation.

Stuart collects stamps like his father does. This also seems correct as his is a pronoun. Or did i get it completely wrong? Can you help Brent? Thanks!
gmat-admin's picture

You're right in that "his" is a pronoun, but that doesn't change the fact that "his father does" is a clause.
It's a clause because it contains a verb (does) and a subject (father).

Pls help me with the following question by explaining why an answer choice is appropriate or inappropriate:

While Jackie Robinson was a Brooklyn Dodger, his courage in the face of physical threats and verbal attacks was not unlike that of Rosa Parks, who refused to move to the back of a bus in Montgomery, Alabama.

(A) not unlike that of Rosa Parks, who refused
(B) not unlike Rosa Parks, who refused
(C) like Rosa Parks and her refusal
(D) like that of Rosa Parks for refusing
(E) as that of Rosa Parks, who refused
gmat-admin's picture

I'm happy to help.
I have provided a step-by-step solution to that questions here: http://www.beatthegmat.com/while-jackie-robinson-was-a-brooklyn-dodger-t...

Cheers,
Brent

What is the general rule for Double Negatives in GMAT?
gmat-admin's picture

Great question!!

In general, the test-makers frown upon double negatives. However, they are totally fine with "not unlike" (as it appears in the Jackie Robinson sentence above and in other official questions).

Hi Brent,

I thought of the choices A and B as double negatives.

What is the difference between

While Jackie Robinson was a Brooklyn Dodger, his courage in the face of physical threats and verbal attacks was not LIKE that of Rosa Parks, who refused to move to the back of a bus in Montgomery, Alabama.

While Jackie Robinson was a Brooklyn Dodger, his courage in the face of physical threats and verbal attacks was not UNLIKE that of Rosa Parks, who refused to move to the back of a bus in Montgomery, Alabama.
gmat-admin's picture

Great question!!

Side story: this question has been around ever since I started teaching the GMAT (circa 2002 :-), but it wasn't until only a few years ago that a student first asked me whether NOT UNLIKE is a double negative.

On the GMAT, the NOT UNLIKE construction is 100% acceptable.

ASIDE: It's important to note that NOT UNLIKE doesn't necessarily mean LIKE, in the same way that NOT TALL does not mean SHORT.
Here's a discussion on this topic: https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/20986/like-versus-not-unlike

Cheers,
Brent

Thank you

Hi Brent,

I am wondering what should I use for comparison of a prepositional phrase:

In Hungary, (as in much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women work, many of which are) in middle management and light industry.

a. as in much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women work, many of which are in
b. as with much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women works, many in
c. as in much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women work, many of them in
d. like much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women works, and many are
e. like much of Eastern Europe, an overwhelming proportion of women work, many are in

Could you help me with why C is correct? Also, why we use 'work' here instead of 'works'?

Thank you!
Kate
gmat-admin's picture

First, the part that follows "IN Hungary" should be parallel to this introduction. For example, answer choice A has parallelism: IN Hungary, as IN much of Eastern Europe...

So, we can eliminate B, D and E.

We're left with A and C.
In A, WHICH cannot be used to refer to people. Eliminate A.

Answer: C

--------------------------------
Q: Also, why we use 'work' here instead of 'works'? (as in "an overwhelming proportion of women WORK"

A:The word "proportion" behaves much like an indefinite pronoun (some, most, any, etc). So, we check the word that follows the preposition. In this example, the preposition is OF.

We have "proportion of WOMEN,"
WOMEN is plural, so, we need the plural verb WORK.

Hi Brent,

Thank you so much for the explanation! So in this question, it does not matter to use 'like' or 'as' at all?

Thanks again!
Kate
gmat-admin's picture

I wouldn't say there's a comparison in this question.
The part that reads "as in much of Eastern Europe" lets us know that this phenomenon is common throughout much of Eastern Europe.

At 6:09 of the following lesson, I discuss the use of "as" and "like" in sentences that aren't making a comparison : https://www.gmatprepnow.com/module/gmat-sentence-correction/video/1175

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent, in the following exercise, the fist thing I did was to eliminate A and E, because of the "as" followed by a noun. Why is it wrong?

The Parthenon was a church from 1204 until 1456, when Athens was taken by General Mohammed the Conqueror, the Turkish sultan, who established a mosque in the building and used the Acropolis as a fortress.

(A) who established a mosque in the building and used the Acropolis as
(B) who, establishing a mosque in the building, used the Acropolis like
(C) who, when he had established a mosque in the building, used the Acropolis like
(D) who had established a mosque in the building, using the Acropolis to be
(E) establishing a mosque in the building and using the Acropolis as

https://gmatclub.com/forum/the-parthenon-was-a-church-from-1204-until-1456-when-athens-13673.html
gmat-admin's picture

That's a good idea, Michele. The only problem is that there isn't a comparison in this sentence. The sentence notes HOW the Acropolis was used.

At 6:09 of the following lesson, I discuss the use of "as" in sentences that aren't making a comparison : https://www.gmatprepnow.com/module/gmat-sentence-correction/video/1175

By the way, there's a nice discussion of this question here: http://www.beatthegmat.com/verb-ing-doubt-t162164.html

Cheers,
Brent

In the statement "he acted like a fool in the party that his girlfriend threw for him"

Can I use which here instead of that?

Thanks
gmat-admin's picture

Hi Mohammad,

We need the restrictive "that" here. Doing so, tells us that, out of all the parties that have occurred in the past, we are talking about the party that his girlfriend threw for him.

If we use the non-restrictive "which," then we are saying that it is obvious that "the party" refers to the party that his girlfriend threw for him.

Here's the video on "that" vs "which": https://www.gmatprepnow.com/module/gmat-sentence-correction/video/1165

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent,

The correct answer choice for the below question is B but I am failing to understand the usage of 'as' here


Even though the company was not able to greatly increase its net worth from 1990 to 1991, improvements were made in high-profile departments as in customer service and public relations.

A. improvements were made in high-profile departments as in
B. improvements were made in such high-profile departments as
C. improvements were made in such high-profile departments as those in
D. improvements in high-profile departments were made in areas like
E there were improvements made in high-profile departments in areas like
gmat-admin's picture

This is just another way to phrase a SUCH AS sentence.

We could write: "...improvements were made in high-profile departments SUCH AS customer service and public relations."

Similarly, we can write: "...improvements were made in SUCH high-profile departments AS customer service and public relations."

Here's a similar example:
We can write: I enjoy citrus fruits SUCH AS lemons and oranges
Or we can write: I enjoy SUCH citrus fruits AS lemons and oranges

Does that help?

Cheers,
Brent

Aaha, got it! I failed to recognize those words are mere examples in the sentence and was confusing them for a noun phrase.

Brent, hi
I am struggling with Verbal section of GMAT
preparation. Could you please help me with them.
I got stuck with use of “As” and “Like”, after explanation
I remember that after “as” it is a verb, after “like” it is a noun, but here is vice versa

https://gmatclub.com/forum/in-a-plan-to-stop-the-erosion-of-east-coast-beaches-the-army-corps-of-22346.html
gmat-admin's picture

Question link: https://gmatclub.com/forum/in-a-plan-to-stop-the-erosion-of-east-coast-b...

Tough question!

In this case, AS isn't being used to make a comparison. The rocks aren't behaving in a manner that can be compared to a buffer. The rocks ARE a buffer.

So, in this case, ACTS AS is equivalent to FUNCTIONS AS.
For example, we might say "Joe works as a carpenter at Acme Fine Homes."

Does that help?

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent,

You said that "as" is used to compare verbs and "like" to compare nouns. What about "linking verbs" like "to be", look, smell

Which are the correct sentences:

1.1 Like Earth, stars are in motion.
1.2 Stars are in motion as Earth is.

2.1 Like cats, dogs smell bad.
2.2 Cats smell bad as dogs smell

3.1 Like Kiril, Brent looks great.
3.2 Brent looks great as Kirill looks.

I am almost certain that .2 sentences are all wrong, Is there a way to use "as" and still make them correct?

Thank you in advance,
gmat-admin's picture

Although most people will feel that the .1 sentences are preferable, the 0.2 sentences are grammatically correct.

i didn't understand 2.50 mentioned question.working isnt action verb?
gmat-admin's picture

The sentence: Carl curses like a lumberjack working in the woods

Here, WORKING is a participial, which makes "working in the woods" a participial phrase that modifies the noun LUMBERJACK.

For more on this, watch:
https://www.gmatprepnow.com/module/gmat-sentence-correction/video/1157

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent,

Could you tell me what is wrong with C and if you were to fix C what would you change:

Researchers are using computer images to help surgeons plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses in the same way that flight simulators do for pilots, letting medical personnel practice their techniques and test their reflexes before they ever see a patient.


(A) plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses in the same way that flight simulators do

(B) plan difficult operations and develop programs to work for doctors and nurses the same way as with flight simulators

(C) to plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses like flight simulators

(D) plan difficult operations and in developing programs to work for doctors and nurses the same way as flight simulators

(E) to plan difficult operations and developing programs that will work for doctors and nurses like flight simulators do

Thank you in advance,
gmat-admin's picture

Question link: https://gmatclub.com/forum/researchers-are-using-computer-images-to-help...

(C) Researchers are using computer images to help surgeons to plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses like flight simulators for pilots, letting medical personnel practice their techniques and test their reflexes before they ever see a patient.

The main issue with answer choice C has to do with what we're actually comparing when we say LIKE.

Our goal is to compare the way the programs WORK for doctors and nurses with the way flight simulators WORK for pilots.
However, "flight simulators for pilots" lacks any kind of verb (like WORK).
So, as it stands, we're comparing the way in which programs WORK with flight simulators

Here's how I'd fix answer choice C:
Researchers are using computer images TO HELP surgeons plan difficult operations and TO DEVELOP programs that will WORK for doctors and nurses in the same way that flight simulators DO for pilots, letting medical personnel practice their techniques and test their reflexes before they ever see a patient.

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent,

Awesome response,

I totally understood why C is incorrect(the word "word" is implied and, therefore, omitted)

I have a few more questions though:

1. If we replace "like", which can only compare nouns, with "as", which can only compare verbs. Would It become a correct sentence or still wrong?

(C) Researchers are using computer images to help surgeons to plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses as flight simulators for pilots, letting medical personnel practice their techniques and test their reflexes before they ever see a patient.

2. What is the proper idiom - "the same way THAT" or "the same way AS". I searched this page to see how often the former version is used as compared to the latter. It turns out that "the same way THAT" is used or "the same way AS" 67% of the time and "the same way AS" is used 33 percent of the time.

LINK: https://ludwig.guru/s/in+the+same+way+[as+that+]

Does GMAT consider both of them as correct:

• to develop programs that will WORK for doctors and nurses in the same way THAT flight
simulators do for pilots
• to develop programs that will WORK for doctors and nurses in the same way AS flight
simulators do for pilots

3. Can we omit "DO" at the end of the sentence or it would be considered incorrect:

Researchers are using computer images TO HELP surgeons plan difficult operations and TO DEVELOP programs that will WORK for doctors and nurses in the same way that flight simulators for pilots.

Thank you very much in advance for your help Brent,
gmat-admin's picture

1. In your proposed fix for answer choice C, I think we still need to see a verb in that comparison.
I would write:
(C) Researchers are using computer images to help surgeons to plan difficult operations and to develop programs that will work for doctors and nurses as flight simulators WORK for pilots, letting medical personnel practice their techniques and test their reflexes before they ever see a patient.

2. I believe that the GMAT is okay with both "the same way THAT" and "the same way AS"

3. Yes we need DO at the end of the sentence.
This allows us to logically compare how the programs WORK for doctors with the way flight simulators DO for pilots.

Very helpful,

Thank you Brent

Hi Brent,

Could you please explain why B is incorrect and why E is correct? E is worded weirdly. B is no better but less awkward.

Financial analysts said they were surprised that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins, investors continue pouring money into the stock market, believing that the American economy was nicely balanced, with little inflation.


(A) continue pouring money into the stock market, believing that the American economy was

(B) continue pouring money into the stock market, believing in the American economy as

(C) still continue pouring money into the stock market in the belief that the American economy as

(D) still continued to pour money into the stock market, believing in the American economy as

(E) continued to pour money into the stock market in the belief that the American economy was

Thank you in advance,
gmat-admin's picture

Question link: https://gmatclub.com/forum/financial-analysts-said-they-were-surprised-t...

(B) Financial analysts SAID they WERE SURPRISED that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins, investors CONTINUE POURING money into the stock market, believing in the American economy as nicely balanced, with little inflation.

- "...analysts SAID the WERE SURPRISED.." So, this action occurred the past.
- "...investors CONTINUE POURING money into stock markets..." So, this action is presently occurring.

So, in the PAST, the analysts we're surprised about something that is PRESENTLY happening.
This doesn't make any sense.
Eliminate B

(E) Financial analysts SAID they WERE SURPRISED that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins, investors CONTINUED to pour money into the stock market in the belief that the American economy was nicely balanced, with little inflation.

This case we are using the same verb tenses to describe two actions that occurred in the PAST.

For this reason, E is the best answer choice

Hi Brent,

I totally understand the logic behind your explanation,

Could you please tell me, whether there are situations when we use the present simple for indirect speech(especially when it comes to GMAT purposes). Let me explain:

Here is the link to the website where the rule is explained(https://www.ef.com/wwen/english-resources/english-grammar/tense-changes-when-using-reported-speech/):

QUOTE

You do not need to change the tense if the reporting verb is in the present, or if the original statement was about something that is still true, e.g.

He says he has missed the train but he'll catch the next one.
We explained that it is very difficult to find our house.

END QUOTE

Let's say that I spoke with my brother a few minutes ago or even yesterday. So the sentence is:

A few minutes ago I spoke with my brother and he said that he is going to help me with my homework.
A few minutes ago I spoke with my brother and he said that he was going to help me with my homework.

Is because I know that he will help me, justifies my usage of present tense rather than past.

What about this type of sentence:

-Recently financial analysts SAID they WERE SURPRISED that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins
people continue to buy new cars every year and that people will persist in their buying behavior in the future. (we mean that they still do it, it is not the past activity).
*In 1985 financial analysts SAID they WERE SURPRISED that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins
people continued to buy new cars every year and that those people would persist in their buying behavior in the future.. (It is definitely ).

What do you think about,

There are a few official questions that use this rule:

Last week local shrimpers held a news conference to take some credit for the resurgence of the rare Kemp's ridley turtle, SAYING THAT compliance with laws requiring turtle-excluder devices on shrimp nets IS protecting adult sea turtles.(WHY IS AND NOT WAS even when we use indirect speech)

Australian embryologists have found evidence to suggest that the elephant IS descended from an aquatic animal and that its trunk originally evolved as a kind of snorkel. (WHY IS AND NOT WAS even when we use indirect speech)

I have used a correct version to just focus on this rule,

What do you think Brent?

Thank you in advance,


gmat-admin's picture

There may be some truth in that position. However the test makers added an additional issue with answer choice B.

(B) Financial analysts said they we're surprised that despite higher inflation and shrinking profits margins, investors continue pouring money into the stock market, BELIEVING IN the American economy AS nicely balanced, with little inflation.

In this case there is no idiom that says "BELIEVING IN X AS Y"

This is not uncommon with the GMAT, especially when it comes to contentious issues such as the one you are raising.
So, to eliminate possible issues, because makers add the second problem with the sentence.

Cheers,
Brent

Hi Brent,

Thank you very much for your patience,

I understand,

Hi Brent,

In the example 'He acted like/as a fool at the party that his girlfriend threw for him.', I had the following doubt:
If we remove 'that' from the relative clause, since it is optional as it is the object, will the dependent clause 'his girlfriend threw for him' act as an adjective or will it act as a clause?
gmat-admin's picture

Both :-)
It's a clause that modifies the noun PARTY (Q: Which party? A: The party his girlfriend threw for him)
In other words, the clause functions as an adjective.

https://gmatclub.com/forum/just-like-the-background-in-art-history-need-by-an-archaeologist-in-or-79021.html

Hi, doesn't 'just as' mean - at the same moment.

gmat-admin's picture

Question link: https://gmatclub.com/forum/just-like-the-background-in-art-history-need-...

Great question!

JUST AS can be used in two ways:

1) JUST AS = AT THE SAME TIME
Joe entered the room JUST AS Sue began singing.

2) JUST AS + SO = a connection between two situations or actions
JUST AS the French love their wine, SO the English love their beer.

Does that help?

Cheers,
Brent

yes, Thank you!

Hi Brent,
Can you please explain the difference between Option A & E? I close A thinking 'goal' as a noun in this case.
https://gmatclub.com/forum/according-to-a-recent-poll-owning-and-living-in-a-freestanding-house-107775-20.html
gmat-admin's picture

Question link: https://gmatclub.com/forum/according-to-a-recent-poll-owning-and-living-...

The sentence starts with:
According to a recent poll, owning and living in a freestanding house on its own land IS still a goal of a majority of young adults,...
So, young adults PRESENTLY have the goal of owning and living in a free-standing house.

Now let's examine the two options:
(A) ...like that of earlier generations.
So this structure tells us that today's young adults PRESENTLY want to own and live in a free-standing house, and this is similar to earlier generations PRESENTLY wanting to own and live in a free-standing house.
In other words, earlier generations still have the goal of owning and living in a free-standing house.

(E) ...as it WAS of earlier generations.
So this structure tells us that today's young adults PRESENTLY want to own and live in a free-standing house, and this is similar to earlier generations ONCE WANTED (in the past) to own and live in a free-standing house.

Does that help?

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